S2E4: Examined Ambition with Adam Webber

In this episode of Purpose Project, host Leslie Pagle sits down with Adam Weber, an entrepreneur and executive coach. The discussion delves into the intersection of leadership, purpose, and business success. Adam shares insights from his journey in the high-stress world as a founder. They discuss the significance of aligning individual purpose with company mission, the role of rituals in achieving purpose, and how businesses can create focused, purposeful environments that drive sustainable success. 

00:00 Welcome to Purpose Project with Leslie Pagle

00:51 Meet Adam Weber: Entrepreneur and Executive Coach

02:20 Exploring Purpose in the Workplace

03:38 The Impact of Purpose on Professional Life

08:41 Balancing Personal and Professional Purpose

17:11 Rituals and Intentionality in Business

19:16 Collective Purpose in Organizations

22:58 Aligning Employee Purpose with Company Goals

24:00 Challenges in Finding Purpose at Work

26:34 The Role of Companies in Employee Alignment

29:18 The Importance of Purpose in Business Strategy

35:17 Execution and Management Clarity

38:03 Final Thoughts on Purpose in the Workplace

39:28 Examined Ambition: A Closing Reflection

Purpose Project is a research study on the topic of life's purpose. You can follow along in the making of Purpose Project:
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Transcript

Leslie: 0:04

Hi, my name is Leslie Pagle and welcome to Purpose Project. In this episode, I sit down with Adam Weber. Adam is an entrepreneur. He is an executive coach, and ultimately Adam is someone who is deeply passionate about helping leaders grow with intention. In this episode, Adam and I explore the intersection between leadership purpose and business success. It's an episode that has me thinking a lot about the role that purpose plays in business, and specifically it's got me thinking a lot about the opportunity that businesses have to drive success through an activated purpose. Let's take a listen. All right. Adam, thank you so much for being on Purpose Project. I'm really looking forward to talking about how Purpose shows up in the workplace.

Adam: 0:59

Thanks, Leslie. Happy to be here.

Leslie: 1:01

Wonderful. Before we get started, tell us a little bit about you. Who is Adam, both personally and professionally?

Adam: 1:09

Well, personally, I'm a husband and a dad. And an avid pickleball player. And I love hiking and, professionally I've was an entrepreneur for, almost 15 years. In venture capital venture tech world. So pretty high stress environment and held a variety of roles in that world. And then now I'm an executive coach, so I support, executives. I support founders on their own growth journeys. In that high intense stressful environment that I once lived in, I helped them become the best version of themselves and create a sustainable version of themselves through a pretty intense time.

Leslie: 1:44

Very cool. Well, that is one of the reasons why I was so excited to have you on the show because as both an entrepreneur and now an executive coach for. Entrepreneurs and, and leaders, I imagine you have an interesting perspective on purpose in the workplace. So looking forward to diving into it.

Adam: 2:05

Excited to dive in. I love the topic. It's different too. Like for me, you know, I was like on the way here, I was like, this is great. Like I haven't actually done a, a podcast on this, so I can't just say all my standard things. I've got to really explore here with you and I'm excited about that.

Leslie: 2:19

Wonderful. Well, let's just dive into that, into purpose in the workplace. When you think about the topic of purpose and you think about, going to work every day, what do you see? How does purpose show up in the workforce?

Adam: 2:34

Yeah, well, I was, thinking on the way here, reflecting one, like purpose is such a, it's such a big topic, in some ways, kind of defining it. I was like almost a little overwhelmed, you know? And then I was also like, but there's aspects, there are things I know are true, you know, of me, um, and like purpose for myself. I think, um, the, the thing that jumped out to me, and I know we're moving parts and pieces and, you know, so like subject to change, hopefully by the time the episode comes out, I'm like, no, that's still true of me. But, I think of my own purpose is like creating. Safety for others to explore, and, to, uncover their highest and best version of themselves. And then also being a person that helps them both find that clarity, but then also give them the confidence on what to do, like how to become that, that version of themselves. Um, and, and so then when I think about how that shows up, so do you mean how it shows up at my work or how it shows up for others at work?

Leslie: 3:30

Let's do both because I'm interested in both sides of your professional career as an entrepreneur and Also as a coach,

Adam: 3:38

yeah, well, I think like for others It's well one is that I don't know if there's much more soul crushing thing that happens for people than when they feel Wholly detached from their purpose at work right when they show up to work and this was a part of my early career for myself And they like feel a thing deep inside of them that is like they're capable of and then they, their work is in misalignment with that and how that just like just is like a weight on your shoulders that you then carry into the rest of your life, right? And then I've seen the inverse of that too, for, for people who there were like hearts are set on fire, where they feel like the work they do is very much in alignment with who they are and how they feel released. Um, and, and then that also spreads into the rest of their life as well. Um, and, and I think a lot of the work I do in coaching is with that. There's so many people you and I were just talking about this before we started recording, like there's such an ambition, but it's not necessarily examined ambition. And so we just go, Oh, I just got to get to the next job, the next promotion, the next promotion without really asking, like what it is that brings you alive. And, and then at some point you, you kind of think you're following this kind of like blind ambition. And then you have an awakening moment, where you go, is that really what I want? Or is that just what society was telling me what I wanted or some story that my parents, some story, I tell myself that my parents put pressure on me. And so a lot of the work that I do, as a coach is helping people really go a level deeper than that to really ask themselves, what is it that you want? And then why? And sometimes in that exploration, you realize like. That isn't what I want. I actually want something different than that.

Leslie: 5:28

Yeah. Well, that is one of the outcomes from season one is that sometimes we don't stop and, and ask the question, what is our purpose or what lights us up or what keeps us up at night? And so when we just get up and we go through the motions of life we get stuck, but it's when we can stop and ask those questions that. We start to get clarity and can look to bring that into the workplace as well. So you're an executive coach. Can you describe a little bit about your clients?

Adam: 6:02

Well, I coach a really wide range of people. I would say there's like three main buckets of people. I coach a lot of early stage founders. Who are really at the beginning of their journey. And that's more like a lot of like. Half tactical coaching, like what do you do at an early stage startup and half like, this is so stressful and like, how do I manage this? And almost every founder starts a company for some deep seated fear, insecurity, or motivator. And so there's a lot to work through. Like there was for me and there is for them as well. And then, so that's one. The other is just like a CEO of a midsize company who gets pressure and inputs from all sorts of people, their board, the executive team, the employee base. And, what I do with them is just give them a space to be an output, where they can think about a problem and explore it deeply and really uncover. I don't need to do a lot of like tactical guidance. It's just giving them space to think and space to process and and to gain some level of clarity and confidence on what to do. Um, and then the third would be, emerging executives. You're an executive at a company and you have been asked to step up, but the business is growing currently faster than you are. And like growth for the individual doesn't really happen without intentionality. And so I create that kind of space for that person to identify, like, where do you want to grow? What are those, what do those things look like? And then let's pick one of those topics and come up with a way to practice something new for yourself, that sort of thing.

Leslie: 7:36

So in your client conversations. It's centered around the business, right? I mean, that's the, the nature of the coaching. It sounds like sometimes it can get personal too. It's,

Adam: 7:47

it's, I wouldn't say it's centered around the business. It's both. It's about the person and work is a huge part of their life, but there are lots of other things that are a big part of their life too. So, I would say it's sometimes it's practical about work and sometimes it's about. Behaviors and patterns that you have yourself. Those are very personal things that limit you at work, and so it's, it's whatever the person needs. I try to not worry about it being like one thing or the other. And I just try to like, let it be about that other person and being a very present person in their life who just gets out of the way and is what they need in the moment.

Leslie: 8:27

I was asking because I'm curious, does the topic of purpose come up in coaching sessions or is it maybe an underlying part of the coaching process?

Adam: 8:41

Yeah, I don't know if it comes up by name. I think it comes up a lot subtly though. Whether it's that search for that next promotion and really examining what it is you want versus what you feel you have to do, what you have this kind of obligation or I call it like almost on autopilot. So, really getting to the root of that. Um, or it just in for founders and entrepreneurs, it's uncovering the deeper, like there's this fear and insecurity that motivates and drives a lot of entrepreneurs and founders. And then there's also this, deeply true motivator that is, why they started the business. Okay, I was wondering. And it goes back and forth. Like, it was for me. It was like that for me, too. Helping them live into this side, the deeply true, this is why I started the business and this is the good I have to do in the world versus deep insecurity that is, that maybe fueled them and allows them to have a drive and an intensity and a motor that a lot of people don't have access to, but maybe doesn't serve them anymore as well.

Leslie: 9:44

Okay. Okay. So in that example with the founder, the motivation, the deep personal reason why I started this. It sounds like purpose, right? Yeah. It sounds like I started this for this purpose. Yeah,

Adam: 10:00

exactly. I think it is. I think it's that. I think it's like, there is that side of it for sure that's a big part of it. It's like, this is the change I want to see in the world, or this is something that's fulfilling to me. Uh huh. And then it's always on a scale, counterbalanced with some, like for me, in my own, journey, I was like, my company was all about unlocking potential of other people. We measured cultures and then we coached executives to, build more inspiring workplaces, right? It's like very much aligned to my core purpose of helping unlock potential of other people and helping them see themselves. And, you know, there's all these threads of like what I find purpose and meaning in. That's one side. The other side is like I was deeply insecure about finances I had this story, I'd tell myself, like, I'm going to go homeless. This is so risky. Why am I doing this? Or, or like, I want to be rich, you know, there was another part. And so these two things and one is, I wouldn't even say one is good or bad. It's not like there's like a good side and a bad side. It's just, there was a helpful side. And this, this one side of this fear of, financial insecurity was incredibly motivating to me, especially early. In my career, it allowed me to really work at a pace that was really, startups are so hard that it gave me the intensity I needed to force success in the world. This isn't like a regular job where you can just go and do the job as long as you're better than other people. It's like, no, I'm trying to invent a thing that doesn't exist in the world that takes a lot of force.

Leslie: 11:30

Right.

Adam: 11:30

And it gave me. Some level of force, but the problem is that it wasn't like sustainable force. It was like, um, my old business partner, uh, Santiago, he called it dirty fuel. There's like clean fuel. That's sustainable, you know, there's this dirty fuel where it's like. Um, it's effective, but it wore out its welcome for me. It created a stress and an anxiety and then that manifests itself in how you lead people. And, and so really like then the leadership journey for me, is just how do I lean in more to the other side to that kind of genuine purpose that is, is like sustainable fuel for me.

Leslie: 12:05

Can that side be the, the force that this other side was?

Adam: 12:12

Um, I

Leslie: 12:13

purpose be that for,

Adam: 12:14

yeah, I think it can. Yeah, I think it. And I think, and many times for most people, I actually think it is, it's both. I think it is, um, because it is a healthier version of force, you know, it's so it's like the other one, comes with it. A lot of velocity of effort, yeah. But it also has a lot of downsides to like, you create, you actually slow down when you work out of your stress and then you treat people in ways that aren't your very best. And then you have to unwind all that work, you end up not moving quickly just because you're moving in like, uh, anxiety or desperation or fear, that sort of thing. Yeah.

Leslie: 12:52

Well, and I imagine when you're moving with that force. The people around you are absorbing some of that energy too, which

Adam: 13:01

might

Leslie: 13:02

not be as positive as your purposeful force. Yeah,

Adam: 13:05

exactly. I mean in there, I think there's this phrase I use a lot for leaders is like to find your calm, steady presence. The very best leaders have a calm, steady presence. They create safety for their employees. Where their employees can come, when their employees see something broken or wrong or inefficient. They can come to that leader and trust that leader values what they have to say, and they might even make changes based on it. And that is very different than when you're leading out of that other side. What you do is you create psychological unsafety, you have unpredictable reactions. You feel oddly defensive, even though these people are trying to actually protect your business. They don't own the business you do. And yet when they come to you, you feel defensive and it feels personal. And what you do then is you create a team of demotivated people who lack commitment and who usually are just looking for other jobs. They're just checking in, checking out. And so that's why it's not valuable for the long term. If it's just you, that's one thing, right? It's your own demons you're working through and your own journey you're working through. But once you've got a team of people to lead, it isn't really sustainable, scalable, or even effective to continue to grow the company through that.

Leslie: 14:18

Yeah. So this podcast is about purpose. So you talk about finding your calm, steady. Yeah. when you're looking for that, is that an opportunity to tap into purpose? Can purpose help bring you into that calm, steady state?

Adam: 14:39

That that's a good question. So like, can purpose help you get to that calm, steady state you're saying? Or

Leslie: 14:46

be in it. Yeah. Yeah. Get to it if you're in a state of anxiety, but also be that calm, steady presence. That you help your clients maintain in their workplace.

Adam: 15:00

Yeah, that's, that's interesting. Cause I, the way I think about it for myself is like this purpose that like I've defined for myself. If I enact it from a calm, steady, rooted, centered, holistic place, I'm doing it in alignment with myself. and you create this kind of natural. Flow and goodness and you're doing it like genuinely, there's then, but when I don't, it almost, it can look the same to the other people, right? But then what I'm not doing is creating like sustainability in myself. For me, like when I give to other people. And I do it from my own strength and from my own security and and my own wholeness, it is rooted in this strong, steady place. But when I am in my own frantic kind of, or desperation or neediness or those type of things, and then I attempt to do it one, I'm not as effective, but two, it's like, I'm not actually in alignment with myself. So. I think that's the, I don't know which, which kind of comes first or the other. I do, I do think, um, that for me finding that kind of calm, steady self, it isn't like. You just decided it actually takes discipline in my life. It's my routines with my phone and, and my habits in my life, that are outside my phone, how I start my morning, how quickly I, check my email, for example, verse reading something timelessly true. Or it's a belief that, like, my physical body is more important than the work that I have to do that day. And so I'm going to dedicate time to that. Um, or going on walks for me is a big deal. Walks without listening to things or, just creating just some space in my mind to reconnect with myself. Those are all things that I feel like when I have that, then I can almost, like, see. And I am, connected to be able to see the purpose But if I, without those things. I'm almost on like on autopilot, you know, it's like the unexamined life where you're just sort of going through the motions versus adding intentionality to, to your life.

Leslie: 17:11

So let's take that as an example. Cause then, uh, that's another thing that came out of season one is this concept of rituals and it's how rituals help us get centered into our life's purpose. It's intentionality around. Going inward in checking in with ourselves so that we can be who we want to be outward. Does that concept apply to business too, as it relates to the topic of purpose? Are there things in business that are also rituals where the business goes in to make sure it's in alignment with its intended purpose in life?

Adam: 17:54

Um, yeah, I think so. I, well, I think there's, there's like the business leaders themselves and like the disciplines they have in their life that have huge ripple effects, like to the rest of the company. Like if the leaders are going through having an examined life and have healthy rituals and habits in their life that help them show up in a calm, steady way that has like. Just such a natural impact on the rest of the company. And then I think just at the, then the company level, it's. I think it's once a year at least, but usually it's once a year. You have all the leaders get together and work through literally the purpose. Why do we exist? Who do we exist for and how do we agree we're going to be with each other? And that last part, the core values and not just like the word core values, but more like how are we agreeing that we behave with one another? And what are those kind of ground rules and setting a firm foundation for that is so clarifying for. Everybody inside the organization like that is a ritual and an intentionality that then and then and then obviously then once you have those you have to enact them, you have to actually hold people accountable when they're not living in alignment with what the business has decided as the rules to play by that sort of thing.

Leslie: 19:16

So in, in your perspective, who owns purpose in the workplace? Is that this executive team that comes together once a year who owns the purpose of the company?

Adam: 19:30

I would say what's so interesting normally, had you asked me two weeks ago or a month ago, I would have told you that it's the founders and the executive team. I'd say the founders vetted by the executive team would be like the kind of fundamental way that I would say that in general. Um, that someone has to put a flag in the ground and, and somebody started the thing and to say, this is why we exist, right? This is the big thing we're doing in the world beyond just like the ticky tack that we show up and do every day. And it is important to remind people both what that is. And then also how their individual job connects to it. I'm doing a project right now where we, we have done, it's a employee owned company. Um, and instead of normally how I would do this is like at an executive leadership retreat, take a two days off site. And that's one of the components of how you spend your time. It's like really either honing or either creating or redefining the purpose. But in this instance, it was like, nope, we want every single voice of the entire company to be a part of crafting this purpose. Uh, and it's been a really interesting project because you, it's like, how do you take in as many voices as possible, create an accurate reflection of that big why the company exists, but do it in a way that's additive versus diluting. Does that make sense? Like, and that was the, that was the, the challenge. I'm like really proud of what we created because I think it's like. It also forces these really honest conversations because every single word has people on both sides, you know, of like, is it this or is it this and Mike and just the, the thoughtful dialogue and, um, and so it certainly not an easy task, but I also think it's really cool. Like, I'm really proud of it to that. It's like we created something that I think. That the, the employees all had a say in, that we're saying like, this is why we exist. This is the big why, of what we're doing in the world, that sort of thing.

Leslie: 21:25

Yeah. Well, and it's why for me, this season, season two is so fascinating because when we think about purpose, we often think about it as, individual, but this is about collective purpose. And what I just heard you say is. It starts by bringing the right people together and letting them each have a voice and then working through that when they are split on each side of the words, how do we come together and see it in the same way?

Adam: 21:57

Yeah. Yeah. And there's this, concept of disagreeing and committing and that gets thrown around a lot in business. And this is like a perfect example of how that lives out. It's that there's disagreeing is like the what I mean by that is when you're in the divergence phase you have a responsibility to represent your perspective and how you see the business from your angle with full confidence Conviction clarity you debate it to the fullest you have a duty to do that especially if you're an executive and then at some point, though, there has to be hard decisions that are made that may or may not be your perspective.

Leslie: 22:33

Right.

Adam: 22:34

And so then when that happens, then that's really where that commit phase, it's like a recognition. This is not ultimately my job, uh, decision to make. I represented my idea to the fullest, and now I'm going to get behind the kind of collective idea. It's not an easy task, but I will say it's easier when you know you represented yourself fully during the divergence phase. Versus kind of this convergence phase that happens later. Um, the other thing I was going to say is for employees and how you create this at the full company level is once you have this defined purpose, the higher order of the business, like the Y that the business exists, then I think what the best organizations do is have each employee think about how do I support this? Like what is this in my life? Like what, how, what is the unique thing I do to bring this to life no matter what your job is? And it takes a little bit of like work to do that, but it's cool if you, run that exercise and then you have people share back what it is, it's like a great way for them to take ownership themselves and, and the dream scenario is that that person can connect the dots to their own purpose. life, their own role inside the business and how it impacts the company purpose. And then those things are in alignment,

Leslie: 23:51

right?

Adam: 23:52

It's not, it's not how everybody's, you know, everybody has different jobs and sometimes that works and sometimes it doesn't, but I think it's a good goal to, shoot for.

Leslie: 23:59

Yeah. How often do you feel like that alignment between Employee's purpose to employee's job to company purpose.

Adam: 24:10

Not very often. Okay. That's what I'm seeing

Leslie: 24:13

too. Yeah. You know, it's, it's not very often and I'm curious why that is.

Adam: 24:19

Um, some of it is like some job. I mean, it's too big of a problem to solve. I'm not quite sure. Like some of it is that the workforce is isolated down jobs. Like kind of like part of the manufacturing era, you know, where it's like assembly line. We do that at tech companies. We do that all over the place. We take, we take diverse, unique skill sets, and then we shrink them down into these isolated jobs. And it's harder to find purpose in those jobs. Um, it's not impossible, but it is harder. So I, I think, I think that's part of it. I think the other part of it is that deep down, people also just need to make money to survive in the world. And so we're talking about a higher order task, which is not available. Like it's, it's not. It's on the, you know, hierarchy of needs. It's kind of higher up on the pyramid. And so it's not something that everyone, um, is able to get to. Like some people just end up having a job to have a job. And I, I think that's a. And now the flip side of that is you can find purpose in that concept alone. Like you can, you can find purpose to go. My purpose is to provide for my family. To live a good life outside of work. Like, work is not, isn't my purpose. And I think that's a perfectly, like, noble and great way to spend your life. Like, you don't have to find this kind of merger of exactly what I do is, you know, I think where tension comes is when it does the, when it's in misalignment. So, where you're actually, like, showing up and it actually, like, It's pulling away from who you're, you're kind of core sense of self. Like you're like, Oh, I really want to do this other thing, but I have to show up and do this.

Leslie: 26:03

Right.

Adam: 26:04

I mean, I, I would, you're, you'd be in a very blessed position if you lived your whole life and never had a moment like that where you didn't just have a job that you were just doing for other reasons outside of the job.

Leslie: 26:16

So in that example, cause one of the things that you started with. Was this, there's nothing more soul crushing than when you're in this situation and your job is kind of pulling you. It's. It's in disalignment with your purpose. What is the responsibility of the business for that situation? Is there a responsibility for the business for employees like that?

Adam: 26:47

What's I don't, that's a good question. I mean, I think, you know, in an ideal world, you'd be open about it and have conversations. I think though, there's all sorts of. I'm going to be talking about a couple of scenarios where the person just like the role or the company, like maybe the company's values are just not aligned, period. And so rather than it being the company's responsibility to fix it, it's, it's the company's responsibility to enact the values. So it's clarifying for the employee that that is not a great fit for them. Even in my, in the scenario for myself, I was talking about like, there were multiple layers that cause that feeling for me. I didn't have enough work to do. Um, so that was a lot of it. Like I, I didn't really have a way to fill my day. And so I was just sitting there, but I was tied to the office.

Leslie: 27:31

Right.

Adam: 27:31

And so I just sat there and I, it was really boring. So that was part of it. I had a little bit of ethical conflict with the role and how I like felt about like the business itself and like, was I in alignment with why the business existed? Um, and like that created tension for me, uh, and, and I think that that was part of it. And that's not really something the business could solve. Or I, I mean, like, they're not going to solve it for me at the very least. Like I was way, early in my career, and so I'm not sure that was a solvable thing for them. Um, so, you know, I think there's a variety of things that cause it.

Leslie: 28:03

Well, and what I hear is ultimately the responsibilities on the individual, you know, if the company's playing its role of living its values and being open and honest and transparent about what those are, which that's a big order in and of itself. That is

Adam: 28:23

the duty of the company,

Leslie: 28:25

but if they are doing that, then, and there's this kind of disalignment, then ultimately it's, it's up to the employees. To take responsibility for, for their purpose.

Adam: 28:37

Yeah, I think, I think it's a, I'm sure it's some version of a combination, you know, nothing's black and white. It's like some version of a combination of that, but I do think we put a lot of pressure on companies, um, to, which is, I think some of that is warranted and some of it is, I think employees really do have an obligation to kind of represent for themselves what they want. And also like to recognize like you have your own choice. Like you get to choose, you are kind of like choosing to work at that company and you have full agency and autonomy to decide where you want to work. And to find that for yourself if it's something that you prioritize.

Leslie: 29:16

Absolutely. So are there advantages in the workplace when purpose is present? And if so what are the advantages?

Adam: 29:28

Well, I think just at the highest level that when a company has a clearly defined why or a purpose, it's always better. Because what it does is that it gives clarity to the employee. One, it can make the employees understand what this is all about. Like, it's easy for executives to take that for granted because they're so close to it. It's easy for people in customer success to take it for granted because oftentimes they get to tangibly see the impact. But 80 percent of the employees are quite disconnected from the big why of the business. And when you have clarity of that big why, it might change the type of things you bring up to your manager. Like where you're going, Oh, wait, what if we did this? What if we did this? And it creates kind of feedback that is directed. Correct way, right? It's towards something feedback can be really broad ideas and strategy, all those things. And what we want is to create some level of a North star that points people toward where we're going. And then beyond that, then if, if the purpose is the tip of the spear, as you start to roll out strategy for the year, initiatives that you're working on. It all points the same direction. There's a consistency to it. And without that, you just create these chaotic environments where people are sort of drifting, you know, and they don't really understand where the business is going and what it's like, what are we all doing here?

Leslie: 31:02

So I hear you saying with purpose, we're all pointing in the same direction. We have an understanding of what we're working towards and why we're working towards it. And what's the benefit of that?

Adam: 31:19

Uh, movement, it's hard to think about what's not the benefit of everybody moving in the same, like, not moving in the same direction is, is the chaotic, uh, I mean, it's sadly like the work environment for a lot of people where we're all moving in different directions and we're not moving in alignment together. But when a group of people have a shared sense of alignment. That's where, that's where great growth happens. That's where, when you look back on your career and those amazing moments, it was a team of people who had clarity of where they were going, who had a stretching goal. And, it wasn't like it was the easiest job. It was that you did something hard together, but you were all pointed in a direction. When I look back on my career, that was the most fun I ever had. Very first startup. You know, our goal, our first year was to get 32 customers or five of us. We're all like a team, like, how are we going to do this? We have one customer, and we got a hundred customers in our first year. Wow. And. Like that year was so fun. It was the hardest I've ever worked in my entire life. And I know I could probably never even replicate that again, but I also look back on it, like we were so motivated. Like I remember that hundredth customer and we all like gathered around and wrote it on this whiteboard. It's just like, wow, look at what we just did. We just took, we were just a team of people who didn't have a real. Job basically before they're like, we started our own job and, um, and not super great careers up to that point. And we like created something in the world that was like really like ours and the other thing that was happening, I think that we maybe didn't even notice was that we were unlocking like all of our careers too, you know, and like, that's just a really, um, it's a really cool thing. And I think it only happened because we were all.

Leslie: 33:01

Okay, I was going to ask, could you have gotten a hundred customers without it?

Adam: 33:05

No way. Okay. That was too hard.

Leslie: 33:08

So it is about outcomes. Cause at one point I was wondering, does it just make us feel good? Is that the outcome that it, that even though it's hard, we feel good about the work that we're doing, but it's also, we feel good, but we can also do things. That we couldn't without it. It creates

Adam: 33:25

focus. I think that's the thing that for like in that scenario It just created a lot of focus.

Leslie: 33:30

Yeah, and focus creates results.

Adam: 33:33

Yeah,

Leslie: 33:33

right. Yep. Yeah Yeah,

Adam: 33:35

you combine focus with the belief that it matters. I think that's part of what purpose does like oh this matters And those two things together really are like, you know, a pretty powerful combination,

Leslie: 33:46

right? Yeah Awesome. Um, do you, because of that, would you consider purpose a competitive differentiation strategy for a business?

Adam: 34:01

Um, like I think a company having a purpose is. Is essential. I don't think it's, I think it's like a non negotiable to me, I guess, like because, and it's because of the thing I shared earlier, um, with the kind of hierarchy of, of strategy, like the, the only way to build a great company is to have a great strategy. The only way to have a great strategy is to have a purpose that tells you where you're, that points the tip of the, kind of the, the North star.

Leslie: 34:30

So let's put two companies up against each other. Both have a purpose.

Adam: 34:35

Okay.

Leslie: 34:36

Are, are they at a similar advantage?

Adam: 34:38

Well, it depends, I think there's three things, one is, uh, it's not just do you have a purpose, it's do you have an activated purpose.

Leslie: 34:46

Okay,

Adam: 34:47

how do

Leslie: 34:48

you live it out? Yeah, yeah,

Adam: 34:49

do, do the, do the employees feel like it's authentic? Do they connect their own role to it? Do they understand the bigger impact in the world? Does it feel believable and real? Or does it feel like a poster on the wall? Like that's one. The second is, um, the values and how you live it out. So do you live it out? Like do you, um, All kind of execute in alignment with one another. And you have rules of engagement of how you kind of move throughout the organization. And then the third is just, is execution. And I cannot stress enough how critical that part is. You can't have it without the other two. Like you do have to have agreement on where you're going and how you're going to behave on your way to get there. But then also, creating a clear strategy. That people are all aligned to and have clear clarity of what the work is I've been in the like work development leadership culture space for 15 years I am stunned by how many employees don't know what work they're supposed to be doing

Leslie: 35:47

really

Adam: 35:47

and they They feel like they don't know how they're doing They don't know what to do. They don't know if they're doing a good job. They don't know exactly where the boundaries of their role is versus their, their colleague's role. And so that chaotic environment leads to poor execution. And ultimately, between those two companies, the one that succeeds is the one that executes. It builds a strategy that communicates and is nimble enough to kind of adjust the strategy and actually does the thing that they say they're going to do. Right.

Leslie: 36:17

Yeah. So why is that, that most employees don't have that clarity where's the breakdown in a business?

Adam: 36:27

Oh, gosh, I could do full episode on it. I'll try to give you the quick, let's see here. My goodness. This is such a big issue. Well, let me ask you this

Leslie: 36:34

way. The short one, is it a lack of purpose?

Adam: 36:37

It's, I don't think it's a lack of purpose. I think it's a lack of good quality management. Um, if you think about what poor management is, it's like, um, back in the, you know, say office culture, it's like people looking around, just making sure people look busy. But they're not really thinking about what work they're actually doing. And I think that the reason it happens is that leaders are so stressed out that they don't create clarity and give feedback to their employees. It's hard work to really sit and think success for this person would be this, this, and this, and actually communicating that. And then assessing on that. Not many. It's, it's almost shocking how few companies actually do that at kind of the management level. This is what the role is. This is what I, this is the expectations. This is what success looks like in here. And then I'm going to give you regular feedback along the way. It seems so simple. But I mean, that's part of why I guess I've been able to have a career is that it is not lived out with consistency at all.

Leslie: 37:42

Well, and then you think about that, just even that conversation, which is very much about executing the job in the role. If that's not happening, then of course, we're not talking about the individual's purpose and how it can be in alignment with their job.

Adam: 38:00

Right.

Leslie: 38:00

You know?

Adam: 38:01

Yeah. Yeah.

Leslie: 38:03

We've talked about a lot. We've talked about who owns purpose um, advantages of having purpose, how it shows up the challenges. Is there anything else left unsaid in this topic of purpose in the workplace?

Adam: 38:19

The one thing I was thinking about is that. I think sometimes we make purpose a pretty grandiose topic. And just to say like that, purpose can look really different. You can have purpose and it not be the actual job that you do. You can find purpose in creative ways. I want to bring my kids to Disney world. I want to have balance in my life and that is my main purpose. Um, and so my job is just a means for that, you know? And so instead of, I think so often we put all this pressure that the tactical work that you do has to be your purpose. I actually don't know that I think that's the case. I think you can find purpose a lot of ways. And so maybe just like to the listener, take a little pressure off yourself or think a layered. beyond the actual work and think about your life, in total. And then think about what that, how that role could feed your purpose.

Leslie: 39:12

Love that. Yes. Any other advice or thoughts?

Adam: 39:17

I think we did it.

Leslie: 39:18

Woo hoo! I do too. I appreciate you coming on Purpose Project and sharing your experience and having this conversation. That was great. Thanks so much. Thank you. In Adam's introduction, he introduces this concept of examined ambition, and he shared how so many times people are just ambitious, but they're going from one thing to the next, from one promotion to the next promotion, and oftentimes that ambition isn't examined. This concept of examined ambition doesn't just apply to individuals. This concept of examined ambition also relates to businesses. Without examining the ambition of the business, we run the risk of just being on autopilot of chasing growth for growth's sake and losing sight of what truly matters. But when we take the time to examine the ambition of the business to ask. Why the business strives for the things it wants. We can move with greater intention. We can move with alignment and focus it's through this examined ambition where purpose becomes a powerful force for business. It is not just for personal clarity, but it is also a force for building businesses that make a meaningful impact. So I'll leave you with this question. When was the last time you examined your ambition? Adam, thank you for being on this show, and thanks to all of you for tuning in. Purpose Project is brought to you for education and for entertainment purposes. This podcast is not intended to replace the advice that you would receive from a licensed therapist or doctor or any other qualified professional.